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Disappointed After Spending 4k In Soundproofing


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#171
zwei

Posted 11 October 2012 - 04:20 PM

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QUOTE (bmkia @ Oct 11 2012, 02:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hi zwei,

You are right that this has reached a stalemate.

You pointed out "maybe Desmond should just give you the amount he offered and forget about removing the installed items". Since 2 out of 3 of the items/ solutions cannot be removed shouldn't this be the case? Its not that I want to keep his "PROVEN" solutions that dont work for me anyways, I can always get another installer to remove this "PROVEN solutions from my car" and return them to him if its removable for a refund.

While you call this an endless loop of bickering, I think any readers with an open mind can conclude from this bickering (at least in my case) of this FACTS raised:-

1) KL Auto is a braggart/ misleading/ false advertiser (words like PROVEN SOLUTIONS/ R&D Team/ BEST is used extensively but could not be substantiated)

2) After sales service is non-existent even if you are not happy/ satisfied with their work (excuses like their phone and records will be lost)

3) If you actually bring your vehicle back and confront DC and his team, they will retweak their "solutions" for you. It may takes years with little or no improvement (unless you buy more solutions and make KL Auto richer) and waste your own time.

3) Recommendations/ Solutions from KL Auto is inconsistent even if you have same problem/ same model of vehicle.

4) Most products put into your car by KL Auto cannot be removed and hence the justification for partial or no refund.

5) The AUTOFOAM application is not administered professionally as claimed with measurements etc. It will just sprayed into your vehicle from re-branded bottles (The original brand is Wurth???) until it seeps out. Side effects will include expansion of the the autofoam into your car's suspension/ timing belts/ other parts and may cause further and new problems.

Well, I have shared more than enough of my actual undisputed sad experience here with KL AUTO and confirm that the "win-win solution" offered would be either to be cheated and suffer in silence OR speaking up and sharing this sad findings here hopefully cautioning some readers of future dealings with KL Auto.


From an owners point of view, I definitely would not want someone whom I no longer trust to further work on my car so I can understand your unwillingness to let KL Auto to further work on the car. In other words, the only working solution for you is to leave the products in your car but take a reduced refund. But it's hard to imagine any seller would agree to doing that though :/

Btw, if quietdrive is a paint-on application product, then I *think* it should be removable either via industrial solvents or by scrapping it off, with the latter solution being very undesirable and unfeasible.

Good luck, I hope both you and Desmond can somehow arrive to an amicable solution soon.

#172
hideiyoshi

Posted 11 October 2012 - 06:56 PM

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QUOTE (bmkia @ Oct 11 2012, 10:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Thank you for your "side show" advice but I already have a life and I am happy with it. I don't see how sharing (you call it "ranting") an unpleasant experience based on "facts" of my first hand experience with a "advertiser" claiming that his "services/products" with words like "BEST / PROVEN / with an experienced R&D team" and ever changing "recommendations" interferes with having a life when I am always connected to the internet at my office/ home and mobile.

Since you are so familiar with the law, why don't you advice KL Auto to sue for me for "defamation" or get a court order against me to stop "sharing/ rambling" here and post it up? And the reason why you don't do this is the same reason why its pointless for me to go to a consumer tribunal.

And if a "false advertiser" can go on preaching that his products do "miracles" here as long as he/she wants, actual customers "conned" by this "false advertisement" can rebut it all he/she wants.


You must remember who started this ramblling, you or KL Auto? It is you whose complaining, not him, it is you who accuses him, not him. If this is the case, and if you think you have a case as you mentioned above, then with this confident, take to the the Tribunal or Small Court. You will WIN cos you are right of course despite the KL Auto having many repeated customer day in & out, high profile satisfied customers with supercars etc etc. Then again, why are you rambling here? Do something concrete, go to court and proof it once & for all, otherwise, have a better quality life, make peace with him and move on with a new chapter of your life.

#173
siv75

Posted 11 October 2012 - 07:53 PM

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QUOTE (KHAWWM @ Oct 11 2012, 04:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hi All,

To be fair to BMkia, i dun think he is a very difficult customer. He merely states his facts here, raised his concern and demand for an answer for a job not so well done. Please remember the following facts :

1) Me and Bmkia are genuine customers that of KL Auto which we have spend more than 3k to do our sound proofing.

2) Both of us esp me has gone back many times to re tweak without much improvement. Total improvement as at today is 10% -15% improvement compared to the stk position.

3) Both the cars that we sent to KL Auto are Mazda 3 that they failed to improve much. If i want to see much improvement, i have to pay additional rm 800 to do up the wheel arch coating with no guarantee its effectiveness.

4) Finally, Desmond do recognised after all the "hoo haaa" we brought up here that Mazda 3 is giving him the biggest headache.

What we do not like to see are these :

1) Stop telling people that your solution is "proven" esp to mazda 3 owner if you are not even sure yourself esp after 2 clear failed cases.

2) Stop telling people that you provide the best service just because you allow customers to come back and do the re tweak. Can you imagine going to a tailor to customised your suit that the tailor cannot get the measurement right for the first or second time and you hv to go back many times to get your suit fix, yet you still say he is a good tailor because he allow you to come back for re tweak ?? As a professional and expert, is expected of you to get it fix first, second or third time max ... you are selling a service not a product and people depend on you to recommend the solutions. After spending close to 4k, you tell me i hv to pay 800 more now for better solution ....

3) Stop telling people that you hv to change your tyre, asking us to complain to Mazda 3 because mazda 3 is famous for its noise ..etc. shouldnt you enlightened us about these first before you recommend your proven solution. Why say all these after all your solution failed ?

We are here not to create trouble for KL auto. We just want KL auto to be more professional going forward in handling customers request, feedback and recommending any solutions. Do not use those big and nice jargon like "Proven " if you are not sure yourself. This is like cheating the customers to get your business and dun blame us if we bring up our experience here to share for the benefit of the readers here.

I do recognised many people have good experience with KL Auto but definitely not in our case.


Dear Khawwm,

Respect your views - even agree that anyone should have a right to air their grouses. Publishing the dissatisfaction once, that's airing grouses. Publishing it over and over again over many many other unrelated threads in an unsolicitated manner, that's anoying everyone on this forum. If it is just to air the grouses, so be it, that has been done and achieved.

As consumers, we have a right to make a decision to buy, not buy, ask for a replacement or ask for a refund. We have no right to demand how a business should be run unless you're a majority shareholder. Don't believe, go demand Digi to stop advertising that the yellow man can reach every square space in Malaysia. What about mileage claims? Are we all getting the mileage our manufacturers advertised? Why not try sending a DEMAND to the big boys on how they should or shouldn't do business.

IF anyone wants, they can continue to air more in this or their own thread. Going elsewhere to someone elses thread to "advertise" this thread - that has a different intention.

Note, if anyone goes to consumer tribunal and wins, the tribunal may ask to refund for the product. The merchant has a right to request the product back in return for the refund. This has already been offered so this affair would be in vain. Also, you cannot seek a refund for products that you are satisfied with. For example, if someone has, in public, in fronts of many witnesses might I add, stated that he or she is happy with autofoam, there would be no grounds to seek for a refund.

On the other hand, Defamation carries a more severe penalty and can go into then tens of thousand of ringgit in awards. The only reason we don't see this so often is because a lot of people in Malaysia are beginning to embrace freedom of speech - something defamation is not compatible with. If Desmond really wanted to shut the thread, he could. He doesn't even need to go to court. All the postings are against forum policy - he just needs to click on that report button on the left to complain to the admin. He won't do this off-course - why? Read his last post. Despite everything, he still wants to resolve things in a gentlemen's way.

So still an avenue exists to end things on a high note. And I do hope this happens.

Cheers

#174
stevecmj

Posted 11 October 2012 - 09:29 PM

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QUOTE (siv75 @ Oct 11 2012, 07:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Dear Khawwm,

Respect your views - even agree that anyone should have a right to air their grouses. Publishing the dissatisfaction once, that's airing grouses. Publishing it over and over again over many many other unrelated threads in an unsolicitated manner, that's anoying everyone on this forum. If it is just to air the grouses, so be it, that has been done and achieved.

As consumers, we have a right to make a decision to buy, not buy, ask for a replacement or ask for a refund. We have no right to demand how a business should be run unless you're a majority shareholder. Don't believe, go demand Digi to stop advertising that the yellow man can reach every square space in Malaysia. What about mileage claims? Are we all getting the mileage our manufacturers advertised? Why not try sending a DEMAND to the big boys on how they should or shouldn't do business.

IF anyone wants, they can continue to air more in this or their own thread. Going elsewhere to someone elses thread to "advertise" this thread - that has a different intention.

Note, if anyone goes to consumer tribunal and wins, the tribunal may ask to refund for the product. The merchant has a right to request the product back in return for the refund. This has already been offered so this affair would be in vain. Also, you cannot seek a refund for products that you are satisfied with. For example, if someone has, in public, in fronts of many witnesses might I add, stated that he or she is happy with autofoam, there would be no grounds to seek for a refund.

On the other hand, Defamation carries a more severe penalty and can go into then tens of thousand of ringgit in awards. The only reason we don't see this so often is because a lot of people in Malaysia are beginning to embrace freedom of speech - something defamation is not compatible with. If Desmond really wanted to shut the thread, he could. He doesn't even need to go to court. All the postings are against forum policy - he just needs to click on that report button on the left to complain to the admin. He won't do this off-course - why? Read his last post. Despite everything, he still wants to resolve things in a gentlemen's way.

So still an avenue exists to end things on a high note. And I do hope this happens.

Cheers


If forum not allow to criticise then this is useless forum! as work as service expert, he should take the challenge n feedback no matter positive or negative; most funny things the expert's RND team, i am wonder if what is their qualification? dont misuse the word

#175
alphawolf

Posted 12 October 2012 - 09:26 AM

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QUOTE (siv75 @ Oct 11 2012, 07:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Dear Khawwm,

Respect your views - even agree that anyone should have a right to air their grouses. Publishing the dissatisfaction once, that's airing grouses. Publishing it over and over again over many many other unrelated threads in an unsolicitated manner, that's anoying everyone on this forum. If it is just to air the grouses, so be it, that has been done and achieved.

As consumers, we have a right to make a decision to buy, not buy, ask for a replacement or ask for a refund. We have no right to demand how a business should be run unless you're a majority shareholder. Don't believe, go demand Digi to stop advertising that the yellow man can reach every square space in Malaysia. What about mileage claims? Are we all getting the mileage our manufacturers advertised? Why not try sending a DEMAND to the big boys on how they should or shouldn't do business.

IF anyone wants, they can continue to air more in this or their own thread. Going elsewhere to someone elses thread to "advertise" this thread - that has a different intention.

Note, if anyone goes to consumer tribunal and wins, the tribunal may ask to refund for the product. The merchant has a right to request the product back in return for the refund. This has already been offered so this affair would be in vain. Also, you cannot seek a refund for products that you are satisfied with. For example, if someone has, in public, in fronts of many witnesses might I add, stated that he or she is happy with autofoam, there would be no grounds to seek for a refund.

On the other hand, Defamation carries a more severe penalty and can go into then tens of thousand of ringgit in awards. The only reason we don't see this so often is because a lot of people in Malaysia are beginning to embrace freedom of speech - something defamation is not compatible with. If Desmond really wanted to shut the thread, he could. He doesn't even need to go to court. All the postings are against forum policy - he just needs to click on that report button on the left to complain to the admin. He won't do this off-course - why? Read his last post. Despite everything, he still wants to resolve things in a gentlemen's way.

So still an avenue exists to end things on a high note. And I do hope this happens.

Cheers


just wanted to add my opinions. what use is a forum is one can't air his grouses? in a business such as KLAuto or others, one cannot expect that all opinions would be in your favour. There would be some unhappy customers, that's part and parcel of doing a business. And i don't really see why this is against forum policy. for an example of a thread that deserves to be shut down, please refer to the Nissan thread. Bmkia, Desmond, et al are still civilised.

plus, it can only be deemed defamatory if the comments are deemed to be done in bad faith. Also, the slanderous material would have to be "published" widely to the general public and if it is deemed to be useful for the information of the general public, then it is not defamatory. Bmkia is initially are trying to tell other people to control their expectations and don't take Desmond's words too blindly, as it is a business and he is selling his services after all, so some marketing puffs are to be expected from Desmond. (my knowledge of the defamation laws are kinda rusty, as I had completed my law degree a while back..so pardon me if it's not 100% right smile_blush.gif )

anyway, these are my opinions, and i hope that this matter can be resolved sooner rather than later, getting kinda bored with it already smile_sleepy.gif

#176
siv75

Posted 12 October 2012 - 05:26 PM

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QUOTE (alphawolf @ Oct 12 2012, 09:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
just wanted to add my opinions. what use is a forum is one can't air his grouses? in a business such as KLAuto or others, one cannot expect that all opinions would be in your favour. There would be some unhappy customers, that's part and parcel of doing a business. And i don't really see why this is against forum policy. for an example of a thread that deserves to be shut down, please refer to the Nissan thread. Bmkia, Desmond, et al are still civilised.

plus, it can only be deemed defamatory if the comments are deemed to be done in bad faith. Also, the slanderous material would have to be "published" widely to the general public and if it is deemed to be useful for the information of the general public, then it is not defamatory. Bmkia is initially are trying to tell other people to control their expectations and don't take Desmond's words too blindly, as it is a business and he is selling his services after all, so some marketing puffs are to be expected from Desmond. (my knowledge of the defamation laws are kinda rusty, as I had completed my law degree a while back..so pardon me if it's not 100% right smile_blush.gif )

anyway, these are my opinions, and i hope that this matter can be resolved sooner rather than later, getting kinda bored with it already smile_sleepy.gif


I'm not an admin! smile_cool.gif I'm a normal user just like you. Just to clarify, I'm referring to the forum policy at the top. And my reference is limited to name calling, personal attacks to a named individual and advertising this thread in other places - which go against forum policy based on activity by bmkia. No idea about Nissan thread but am not sure if it also has a named individual/business being attacked in that instance instead of a simple nick-name.

According the forum policy, it is perfectly ok to air grouses. In fact, I can agree that KHAWWM (the originator of this thread) has indeed only aired his grouses - and I stated that I respected this.

#177
bmkia

Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:56 PM

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QUOTE (alphawolf @ Oct 12 2012, 09:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
just wanted to add my opinions. what use is a forum is one can't air his grouses? in a business such as KLAuto or others, one cannot expect that all opinions would be in your favour. There would be some unhappy customers, that's part and parcel of doing a business. And i don't really see why this is against forum policy. for an example of a thread that deserves to be shut down, please refer to the Nissan thread. Bmkia, Desmond, et al are still civilised.

plus, it can only be deemed defamatory if the comments are deemed to be done in bad faith. Also, the slanderous material would have to be "published" widely to the general public and if it is deemed to be useful for the information of the general public, then it is not defamatory. Bmkia is initially are trying to tell other people to control their expectations and don't take Desmond's words too blindly, as it is a business and he is selling his services after all, so some marketing puffs are to be expected from Desmond. (my knowledge of the defamation laws are kinda rusty, as I had completed my law degree a while back..so pardon me if it's not 100% right smile_blush.gif )

anyway, these are my opinions, and i hope that this matter can be resolved sooner rather than later, getting kinda bored with it already smile_sleepy.gif


Someone with a law degree definitely makes more sense than a paid clown and or actual proxy who seems to claim that he is a sound expert, English expert, defamation expert and most recently a forum policy expert. If you read his other posts in this same thread or other threads, you can conclude he is indeed a paid clown and or actual proxy. This clown is only an expert at one thing from the beginning, that is a "side show/ topic diverter" expert.

For me this matter is concluded and considered resolved at this impasse (sorry if I have bored you and others). I have said and raise enough "complaints/ ramblings / facts" from the postings, replies and interactions about the actual level of service and marketing gimmicks employed by KL Auto here. The very least I hope some readers with an unbiased open mind can read and judge for themselves before proceeding to soundproof their rides on whether I am a very fussy disgruntled customer vs the said installer being not very honest and professional based on everyone's postings here. At least I got some good laughs from some posts here especially the "psyche" assessment and the excuse "We were Not given a chance to Finish our Job!".

Dear KHAWWM,

I wish you best of luck on trying to actually reduce the road noise with KL Auto if you had yet to give up. As we have already been victims of "misleading advertisements" and "promises" but with only 10-15% actual improvements on our rides after money and time spent, my personal advice for you is to not waste more time and money with re-tweaks but proceed to soundproof your doors at any other installers. Based on my actual experience on our specific car model (sorry ya... I don't have an experienced R&D team), doing this will reduce the most "noise" be it traffic, tyre etc for our ride to a much more acceptable level. You can take some comfort as well if you infer that KL Auto's own change of stance in his soundproofing if you read his posts here and elsewhere in this same forum which now recommends soundproofing the doors and showing off after how solid your doors sound (swallowing his own words about making your ride a tank).

#178
jflcorp

Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:09 PM

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I have reported this incessant ranting and defamatory posts from a certain disgruntled wuss.

Let the admin deal with such childish and immature wussies. It has gone from bad to worse. (anybody who doesn't support this wuss is now a paid clown? BULLCRAP - Grow up and come out of hiding below the bedsheets.)