QUOTE (gregy @ Nov 21 2013, 12:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Fren, this issue has been done to death many years ago lol... Honda had already rectified the issue, replaced the GBs of those affected under warranty and instructed all SCs to use the proper CVT fluid.
I had my City iDSI from 2003 to 2008, clocking 185,000km and had none of the issues associated with the GB, because I changed the fluid at 30,000km or 6mths (whichever came first) intervals religiously.
My MIL who still owns a facelift City VTEC 2005 from Day One, has only 35,000km on the clock today. Last year I drove her car and found that it was exhibiting the symptoms of CVT problem, so I promptly had the GB fluid replaced with genuine CVTF. Fixed the problem instantly. I suspect that because of her car's extremely low mileage, her regular mechanic failed to inform her to get the CVTF changed.
For those who think CVT is problematic and expensive to repair, consider the fact that for a quality refurb of a regular autobox, it will also set you back a couple of thousands, so why don't we hear them complaining? Wear and tear is normal, and since 2k plus is all you need to set the car straight, just be thankful and enjoy the smooth drive of your CVT loh.
I had my City iDSI from 2003 to 2008, clocking 185,000km and had none of the issues associated with the GB, because I changed the fluid at 30,000km or 6mths (whichever came first) intervals religiously.
My MIL who still owns a facelift City VTEC 2005 from Day One, has only 35,000km on the clock today. Last year I drove her car and found that it was exhibiting the symptoms of CVT problem, so I promptly had the GB fluid replaced with genuine CVTF. Fixed the problem instantly. I suspect that because of her car's extremely low mileage, her regular mechanic failed to inform her to get the CVTF changed.
For those who think CVT is problematic and expensive to repair, consider the fact that for a quality refurb of a regular autobox, it will also set you back a couple of thousands, so why don't we hear them complaining? Wear and tear is normal, and since 2k plus is all you need to set the car straight, just be thankful and enjoy the smooth drive of your CVT loh.
Well said, gregy.
I've been driving a 2003 iDSi without transmission problems since day one - but all good things must come to an end, and the CVT has finally started giving me the dreaded jerking problems after just going over 150,000km. I'm thinking of checking out the Sg. Buloh Mechanic that was recommended on this thread, has anyone had their box done there? Would love to hear about your experience
Having said that, of all the maligning and criticism that has been levelled at Honda regarding CVT problems, a lot of it stems from a (relatively) poor understanding of the CVT itself.
For instance, the initial batches of Honda CVT cars had problems with the transmission due to someone in Honda messing up and recommending ATF for the CVT instead of CVTF - probably due to thinking that if it doesn't need manual gear-changing, it's an "automatic" gearbox. Certainly, Honda shares the blame for this one. The fix is to change the fluid to proper CVTF (and changing the fluid on schedule every time).
As to the problems with the CVT that owners face after a few years (and 100k+ on the odometer), it's much less Honda and much more CVT.
The CVT used in Honda cars, as most of us know, is of a steel V-belt type. Special steel belts made of steel bands with steel links are used with pulleys in the gearbox to effect the changes. Compared to, say, a toroidal CVT (which are used in some other cars), this type of CVT allows a very compact and efficient gearbox (along with the infinitely smooth "gear" changes of a CVT). However, the bands, like any belt, are subject to great stress every time the car accelerates (especially from standstill or slow speed).
The problem is that unlike gears, which can be forged with very strong material to be nearly indestructible, steel belts have to be flexible (of course). Everything comes at a cost though, and the trade-off the steel belts demand is long-term durability - after a certain mileage, the belts tend to stretch and separate or come apart. This results in problems like jerking during acceleration, the car engine stalling or, in worst case scenarios, the band snapping (therefore immobilising the car).
In fact, the consensus I've seen in the industry regarding steel belt CVTs is that they tend to last up to about 100,000-120,000km or so - any more than that and it's generally living on borrowed time, depending on how aggressive your driving style is and how well you care for your CVT. This is regardless of brand of car (I've seen a disintegrated belt from a Mini CVT), so it is a little unfair to aim squarely at Honda for it.
So what can be done?
The belt-type CVT's greatest weak point - the belt - is also one of its greatest advantages when it comes to EOL (end-of-life) repair: you just change the belt! Well, along with some other small worn-and-torn parts like gaskets, CVTF filters and such, but it consumes a lot less time, materials and cost than, say, a typical AT with its many epicyclic gears or even a toroidal CVT. The only exception is if the band snapped - then the steel links would be scattered (like a broken pearl necklace) all over inside the gearbox and would jam themselves into (and potentially damaging) every moving part. The gearbox would in this case require a complete replacement.
Although changing the belt is conceptually straightforward, the problem is that CVTs are still a rarity in this part of the world, so finding someone who has the know-how and access to spare parts is the single biggest problem for us CVT owners.
Of course, Honda service centers would just get you to change the whole CVT, which is the easiest (and most costly) way to do it. To be fair, I've read through Honda's service manuals for the Jazz and City, and noted that they do not describe any procedure for replacing the CVT belt - so that's another reason it's generally not offered by the service centres: it's just not done.
Ultimately though, I don't hold a grudge against Honda, because as gregy said, wear and tear is normal, plus I've learnt (even if only recently) about the typical life expectancy of such CVTs so it didn't come as too nasty a surprise. Otherwise the CVT has been beautiful in terms of driving smoothness and fuel economy and I'm just grateful it's lasted more than a decade.
